Project Feedback

Discuss your experiences with and ideas about Stardust@home here.

Moderators: Stardust@home Team, DustMods

Would You Like Project Feedback?

Poll ended at Sat Apr 28, 2007 4:50 am

Yes
10
100%
No
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 10

wglc
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 1:09 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

Project Feedback

Post by wglc »

As a retired research physicist, I'm not participating for the certificates. I wish to continue contributing to the advancment to science. The only reward I seek is project feedback so I know what progress is being made. A simple table would suffice. I'm sure once established, the table could be automatically updated by a computer so as to not encumber the team with more work. A recommended format follows: (note leading periods are needed to align the table entries in this posting.)

Last Updated: MM/DD/YYYY

..........................................................Number........Percent of Total
Plates Photographed
Movies Availble for Screening.........................................NA
Movies Screened
Movies Deemd Out-of Focus...........................................NA
Out-of-Focus Movies Re-shot
Tracks Found Since Last Update.....................................NA
Total Tracks Found..........................................................NA
Willy

xxxxxy
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 2:11 pm
Location: Slovenia
Contact:

Post by xxxxxy »

I agree. We are completly without informations since november. Everything is going so slow. Nothing was repaired, litle updated, etc...

the moon
Posts: 177
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2006 12:34 am

Post by the moon »

I can fill in the last line for you
Total tracks found.....................0

This program was already poorly funded and staffed from the start, it wouldn't surprise me if they've lost even more funding and staff since it turned out there aren't as many particles as they thought there would be, or they're much harder to find. That would explain why the updates stoped.

Nikita
DustMod
Posts: 994
Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 8:33 pm
Location: Indiana, USA

Post by Nikita »

I am not a part of the Berkeley team, so what I say is my opinion only.

There are very few people working on this project. We have already mentioned that people may come and go, but on average there are six. Of those six people, all of them have multiple projects that they are involved in. NO ONE has this as a full time job. Add on top, some unexpected problems that have come up (Typical science) and the fact that they all have personal lives gives a little bit of an understanding of what they are going through. I believe they want to give updates as much as we would like them and really do appreciate the work we do.

I'm sure that they want to give updates, but we have to accept things in the order of priority. First, I believe everyone wants the errors fixed. Second, we want new movies, old ones retired and results of the search so far. Then we go into individual preferences, such as updates, revising the focus bar, reversing the images, using a different provider, providing alternate languages.... Simply put, there aren't enough people to do that and some requests would make some happy, but would push back the progress on the whole because it would cost more time to modify than would be gained.

But we are being listened to. Bryan is updating as he can and has posted a reply to the errors. So we know he is reading and working on it. Remember the certificates? We requested and we got them! No, it wasn't instant, but it came. Can we get a time table? Well, if this was an exact research program like final stages of a study, perhaps. But we have already came across more varibles than we expected. Old timers can remember waiting from May 17th to August 1st on the forum just to get started! We waited and waited.... But it finally happened!

In the end, I can only suggest to just be patient. Science takes time, and lots of it. This stuff is so precious that we have to proceed so slowly to get it right. If we goof, we can't just pitch it and start over. I cannot say this as opinion of the team, but I wouldn't be a bit surprised if we don't get ANY official notification of particles until this stage of the project is over.

And this message isn't just to the people who have posted complaints on this thread or any others, I thing everyone has felt this at some time or another. It's natural. Especially if you are a FTF (First to Find) and you want to know what the result is of your click!

I hope this helps put the process into perspective and that I am not off target in what I say.

Good luck to everyone!
From dust we come

fflo
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:37 am
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Post by fflo »

Nikita wrote:I am not a part of the Berkeley team, so what I say is my opinion only.
..................................................................................
I hope this helps put the process into perspective and that I am not off target in what I say.

Good luck to everyone!
I am also a retired phycicist, "dusted" already through about 41,000 movies in total and know that we are volunteers in a unique endeavour.
And I agree fully with what Nikita said, very diligently and politely.
There is a lot of feedback in all the threads of this forum and in the material which is presented to us. I can understand that it is cumbersome for any newcomer to work through all of it.
But I would expect, from a seasoned researcher, that in this endeavour one should not try, after ten days, to get in the driver's seat.
So: Good luck to everyone- and Patience to those who need it!

-------------- and to dust we go.



.

Pupper
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:27 pm

Post by Pupper »

I can not disagree with anything said by Nikita. However, some form of feedback or updates on a regular basis would help keep interest up. Many of the dusters in the top 100 a few weeks ago are no longer looking for one reason or another. I would guess that the average number of movies reviewed over the last few months has been in steady decline. When a score of 900 puts someone in the top 1500 it is an indication of the number of active dusters. Since the project is dependent upon volunteers, I believe that occasional updates would go a long way in inspiring the current dusters that someone is noticing and progress is being made. The update could be as short as one paragraph or as detailed as the one last December. Anyway, I plan to keep dusting and find that one speck I know is out there!

greuti
Posts: 200
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 10:11 am
Location: Switzerland

Re: Project Feedback

Post by greuti »

wglc wrote:As a retired research physicist, I'm not participating for the certificates. I wish to continue contributing to the advancment to science. The only reward I seek is project feedback so I know what progress is being made. A simple table would suffice. I'm sure once established, the table could be automatically updated by a computer so as to not encumber the team with more work. A recommended format follows: (note leading periods are needed to align the table entries in this posting.)

Last Updated: MM/DD/YYYY

..........................................................Number........Percent of Total
Plates Photographed
Movies Availble for Screening.........................................NA
Movies Screened
Movies Deemd Out-of Focus...........................................NA
Out-of-Focus Movies Re-shot
I fully agree with Willy regarding such regular data of the movie pool wherein we are searching!

Pupper
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:27 pm

Post by Pupper »

It now over a month since the last short but interesting update. It is really time for another one. It would be really nice to know what type of progress is being made on this project. Communications is one of the things that keep this project moving. I believe that the project is slowing down. Thanks.

DustSabre
Posts: 63
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 4:51 pm

Post by DustSabre »

I believe that the project is slowing down.
I'm definitely getting that feeling, too. Communication and organization are the life of a project, and without it, any project will drift into a lifeless limbo. In short, the biggest problem that I think we are starting to run into is this: An organized and communicative team, heading up a worthwhile project, will attract driven people with experience and talent who will work hard to accomplish the goal. On the other hand, a half-hearted team, or even a hard working team that never tells anyone anything, will not be able to attract hard working individuals to participate, and their project will slowly die out. Just look at this forum; people are not posting as much as they apparently used to in times past. Unless the Stardust@home team pulls things together a little more, I'm afraid that the outlook for the project might just get steadily bleaker as time goes on. :( However, more communication, updates, and statistics could dramatically improve things. :D

mmolvray
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Oct 30, 2006 9:18 am
Location: Los Angeles, USA
Contact:

somewhere there's a diagram of the aerogel + "done"

Post by mmolvray »

This is really frustrating. I just spent half an hour going through this whole site and Stardust on JPL and I can't find it. *Somewhere* I stumbled upon a picture of the whole collector plate with darkened segments to show which ones had been turned into movies, and which ones were in the process of being studied by us dusters.

A more obvious link to that would be interesting for all of us, and it might provide some of that feedback people would like. I can't believe I can't find it now that I'm looking for it. :?

the moon
Posts: 177
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2006 12:34 am

Post by the moon »

It's stickied in the updates section. But it hasn't been updated in over a month either.

Wolter
DustMod
Posts: 457
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 2:23 am
Location: Enkhuizen, the Netherlands

Post by Wolter »

From the latest update on March 27th :

"The Cosmic Dust Laboratory will be shut down to interstellar tray scanning for about two months starting next week to catch up on allocations of interplanetary dust particles (IDPs). During this time, we will modify the scanning system to accommodate a micromanipulator -- the main job is machining a new mounting plate for the interstellar tray -- then we will practice doing extractions of ''picokeystones'' on the Stardust interstellar flight spare tray. These will enable us to image the tracks, and determine trajectories. The next steps will depend on what we find!

While scanning in Houston is shut down we will be uploading high magnification movies from several tiles for searching in the VM. We will also be uploading new calibration movies to go along with these new movies."

My guess is that a next, meaningful, update can't be expected for another month or so from now.

Dusting for stardust is as tedious as your average household dusting. Only the rewards afterwards differ greatly. (at least that's my opnion...)
Just dusting... Image

xxxxxy
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 2:11 pm
Location: Slovenia
Contact:

Post by xxxxxy »

Just new updates and new unseen movies please!

Image

I almoast pray for them.
Bojan AmbrožiÄ

DustSabre
Posts: 63
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 4:51 pm

Post by DustSabre »

I like that... :lol:

Personally, I think this whole Stardust thing is a camouflaged psychological experiment in which :twisted: researchers are trying to see how long people can go without information before becoming insane. So far, it looks like they're beginning to succeed, as the first signs of insanity are finally appearing in some of the subjects of the experiment. :mrgreen:

fflo
Posts: 63
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:37 am
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Re: somewhere there's a diagram of the aerogel + "done&

Post by fflo »

mmolvray wrote:This is really frustrating. ............................................. I can't find it. ...................................
A more obvious link to that would be interesting for all of us, and...........................:?
Here it is, the link to topic -- Picture perfect: aerogel scanning process

http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... c.php?t=78

:) and keep dusting

fflo

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