Am I worthless?

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ac220
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:05 am

Am I worthless?

Post by ac220 »

On a first day i've got just one or two errors.
On the second one - nine errors, all false negatives, and now another one... my sensitivity is stinking 82%, with little chance to go up now. I could pretend and call this "pickiness" but it isn't, there are 3 rather doubtful events i clicked (another one was an accidental click on not-yet-loaded movie, so I don't count it.)What's that? Inexpirience? Poor attention span? Eyesight problem? (i'm for all practical purposes one-eyed)

I'm on a brink of giving up, although I think that projects like that are more important than all the rovers and orbiters for the Mars combined. That's how science of the future should look like, with everybody doing some part of it directly, everybody feeling it. You know your contributon is real, it's not like donation of money or CPU time.
(conspiracy theorists here think that SETI@home is really NSA, not NASA :), and mere thought of my money grinded by some (bad) bureaucrat with no reall effect keeps me from donating, even if I hadn't been almost broke few months ago )

Also, direct participation of the "lay" public is the only efficient way to dispell widespread misconceptions about science and scientists. Only truth of one's own actions and expiriences is undeniable, the rest could be spinned by charlatans to death...

You're doing a great job... Maybe, even we're doing one, but I simply do not know... What's wrong with me?

Sorry for long-windedness.

stardust1
Posts: 161
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2006 2:08 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Am I worthless?

Post by stardust1 »

ac220 wrote:... What's wrong with me?...
Nothing!
You are surely doing a great job! Because:
- You recognized 82 % of the Calibration movies.
You will become better by and by. The movies are not 3D, so "being one-eyed" should be no problem. Other possible sources of error you already realized. :wink:
- You picked 3 movies out of hundreds (I guess), thus reducing the time, scientists would have to get through instead. The validation of your finds should not be your problem. You just act as you have been trained by the tutorial. If you want to improve your skills on your own account, you´ll find a lot of advice on this forum.
Happy dusting!
Wir leben in einer Zeit vollkommener Mittel und verworrener Ziele. (Albert Einstein)

DustBuster
DustMod
Posts: 694
Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 8:12 pm
Location: Horsetown, USA

Post by DustBuster »

Well said, stardust1- and a sentiment shared by the gallery I'm sure. If nothing else, there's plenty of support on the forum and in the forum as well.
If you are getting discouraged, it will pass as stardust1 stated- and you can always take a break by reading through the forum and getting to know your associates (and some great tips are buried in here!).

The math at 10,000 users was that we each only needed to spend about 1 minute per day to accomplish our goal- now we're approaching 20,000- so don't feel bad about taking a break.
I find browsing the APOD site quite inspiring for dust searching.

spincrus
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:55 pm
Location: Turkey
Contact:

Post by spincrus »

Couldn't agree more with stardust1.

I actually agree with you too, on the "public participation to scientific research" issue. I was thinking about the exact same thing the other day, when I was watching a documentary on global warming and how something similar to SETI@home or the Human Genome Project is currently also being done on estimates of future temparature changes of our planet. They're going since 2005 and have 100.000 members (don't know when the documentary was shot, but seemed very recent).

This should, really SHOULD be the science of the future. Not only mere CPU power and stuff, but more personal involvement in the whole deal.

On the issue of your eyesight problems: being one-eyed doesn't make you half a participant.
spincrus est imperare orbi universo!
spincrus erit in orbe ultima!
spincrus invictus...

spincrus
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:55 pm
Location: Turkey
Contact:

Post by spincrus »

DustBuster wrote:I find browsing the APOD site quite inspiring for dust searching.
It doesn't surprise me to see people in this community who are aware of the APOD and have been following it for quite some time (even before Stardust@Home got featured) :lol:
spincrus est imperare orbi universo!
spincrus erit in orbe ultima!
spincrus invictus...

DustBuster
DustMod
Posts: 694
Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 8:12 pm
Location: Horsetown, USA

Post by DustBuster »

spincrus wrote: On the issue of your eyesight problems: being one-eyed doesn't make you half a participant.
I totally missed that part... but I have great story for it:

When my daughter was about 2 years old, we went to the post office for some stamps. There was a clerk running around that was wearing an eye patch... I didn't even see him until my daughter exclaimed (to everyone in the post office), "Look Daddy, there's a pirate!"
Even if you might be a pirate, your contribution is welcomed- ARRGG!

spincrus
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:55 pm
Location: Turkey
Contact:

Post by spincrus »

:lol:

That's hillarious. I'm sure he's getting odd looks from kids quite frequently for the eyepatch, but the pirate comment just cracked me up.
spincrus est imperare orbi universo!
spincrus erit in orbe ultima!
spincrus invictus...

Groundling
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2006 6:55 pm
Location: Oregon, USA

2 dimension

Post by Groundling »

Hi ac220;
Let's cut to the chase. I am looking at a 2 dimensional display! If I was a Cyclops I would have the same view as everyone in this enterprise!
The ability to identify "a track" is only to be able to tell if an object is in focus.
That is to say: When you find "the surface" of a movie, objects that become better focused below the "surface" are the object that we search for.
No one in this group can see some thing in 3 dimensions; only a matter of focus.
The trick is to watch how an image changes as you move the focus control. This is the same as one would move a magnifing glass.
That is the only way any of us can make a judgement.
Read the early questions and comments. They are a better way to learn.
That was when we all were searching for a way.
Groundling
I have met the enemy and he is us.
Pogo

ac220
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:05 am

Post by ac220 »

Thanks, everybody, your advice and inspiration are of great value. I'd probably give it a break for this weekend, reading forums and retrying test to get more confident instead of going for my aim of 100 movies daily.


And no, I do not need eyepatch, it's not that bad, eye is in place, it just does not focus almost at all.

elainekeefe
Posts: 190
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 4:38 am
Location: Massachusetts, USA

Post by elainekeefe »

Hi ac220, welcome to our ever growing and diligent group of stardust searchers. I would not get too discouraged by your scores. We've all (or most of us anyway) been there. Most of us made most of our errors in the beginning of the project, when we were still not quite sure what we were looking for. And, as your accuracy increases, your score will go up. I have viewed around 9500 calibration movies, with 11 errors. 8 of those errors were in the first 800 or so, and my scores are presently in the 99th percentile range. So it certainly can be done!

A couple of tips for you: Make sure the movie is fully loaded before you click "no track" so you can see the bottom frames. Also, many movies are either slanted or do not focus deeply enough to make a determination. In that instance, you should click on "bad focus." I find calibration tracks easy to find...they are usually darker and sharper than the surrounding objects. The no-tracks...for me anyway...are a little harder. Since no one knows for sure exactly what we are looking for, many of us tend to click on anything that looks unusual. Tracks, however, should be below the surface. There are many surface objects that look like tracks, but they tend to fade out and/or disappear as you go deeper into the movie.

Hope this was helpful, and good luck in your searching!

ac220
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:05 am

Post by ac220 »

Thanks again.... It seems that I have understood what are my problems...

1) One particular type of track, not like normal "surface bump"-"crater"-"defocus" pattern. It's crater is small, almost like point and for some reason track's "entry point" isnt at the same coordinates "crater" is.

2) I've found that for me more frequent long breaks (20 minutes one every 15 or so movies) keeps attention sharper, mood more objective and relaxed, and no one would complain of low throughput :) . I'm not rating-chaser, I just want do it right.

Nikita
DustMod
Posts: 994
Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 8:33 pm
Location: Indiana, USA

Post by Nikita »

It is possible to be a rater chaser and want to do it right. There is nothing wrong with striving to get to the top 100 for the purpose and to be doing this at all to help the science. There is no prize money for the top and it's not like the whole world is watching to see what we do. We all have to admit, it takes a lot of commitment to the project to get to the top 100, regardless of the motive why. As long as it is the right way, have a blast and enjoy! No matter your score, you want to do it right and that is what is important! :D

ac220
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:05 am

Post by ac220 »

Nikita wrote:It is possible to be a rater chaser and want to do it right.
Of course. No offence meant :) But it's just not my way of doing things.

BasketCase
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 2:50 pm
Location: Owensboro, Kentucky

Post by BasketCase »

ac220

I know exactly how you feel. and the name of it is frustration. When I first started I missed 37 before I got to 100, and was ready to quit. But I kept plugging and only missed 20 in the next 4000 movies. I slowly figured out some of the things that I was doing wrong and my score has improved...bit I still scream when I miss another one.

There are some really good tips in the forums, but no easy way to find them...you just have to read all the threads. I would suggest that you forget the 100 a day and just do what you can. When you give yourself goals like that, you will rush and that will bring on mistakes. Slow down, the movies come to you at random, so your chance at being the first to view a movie is just as good one time as another.

I just discovered that when I miss another movie it often is when I become tired or drowsy and get careless. Just be careful and take your time and you will do just fine.

Hope this helps.

Basketcase

kirby
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu May 18, 2006 9:55 am

Post by kirby »

ac220 wrote:Thanks again.... It seems that I have understood what are my problems...

1) One particular type of track, not like normal "surface bump"-"crater"-"defocus" pattern. It's crater is small, almost like point and for some reason track's "entry point" isnt at the same coordinates "crater" is.

2) I've found that for me more frequent long breaks (20 minutes one every 15 or so movies) keeps attention sharper, mood more objective and relaxed, and no one would complain of low throughput :) . I'm not rating-chaser, I just want do it right.
I'm so happy to see you have known 'I'm not rating-chaser, I just want do it right' :)

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