Any "Official Comment" up to now?

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andrea
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Any "Official Comment" up to now?

Post by andrea »

Having checked a lot of movies (about 1500 "real" ones), I submitted 42, and I see that 21 have agreement from at least another StarDust@Home member, but all of them are still with "Indeterminate" status. :cry:
Up to now, anyone obtained an "Official Comment", positive or negative? :shock:
Bye

Andrea :D
Andrea Pelloni
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Co-discoverer of Sn2005bp-Sn2005dz-Sn2005kd-Sn2006bq

Nikita
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Post by Nikita »

I don't think we would get any results this early. They will probably wait for further positives before exploring. Why? Well, we're all excited and may be clicking on the same things that aren't there. The calibration movies also give them an idea of our accuracy. Tracks marked from individuals with a higher score will indicate more possibility of a positive track. Plus, once they decide something needs attention, I think they will have to identify the film, review it, locate the gel, check it on the microscope, then decide to extract anything, if there, and then look at what came out. I may be wrong, but this stuff is priceless and I expect they will be taking their time so as not to damage the aerogel and whatever is in it. I don't think this will be duplicated!

But boy, the wait to see if we found anything. I think I'm like most, at this point, being first to find (FTF) would be fun, but to at least know if I was right would be great! :)

Good luck on dusting!
From dust we come

andrea
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Post by andrea »

Nikita wrote:I don't think we would get any results this early. They Good luck on dusting!
Nikita, 15 days from previous posts, but I still have only Official Comments for 11 "Bad Focus" over 83 reported movies. :cry:
My main doubt is the following one:
why are they checking the ones with the lower number of agreements, while I have one that has a sore of 87 over 136, and surely there are a lot of checkers in a similar situation?
I think such a working way has a negative psychological effect, because I'm sure that:
1- if we can see how appear the "Real" dust in the aerogel we could work and check in a better way;
2- seeing at least one positive result over the zillion movies reported from thousands of people would give a strong boost to check more and better, because results really exist!
What do you think about?
Bye

Andrea :D
Andrea Pelloni
MPC 157 Frasso Sabino Obs
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Co-discoverer of Sn2005bp-Sn2005dz-Sn2005kd-Sn2006bq

Wolter
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Post by Wolter »

appearently you missed this update: http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... .php?t=797
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andrea
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Post by andrea »

Wolter wrote:appearently you missed this update: http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... .php?t=797
Wolter, obviously I missed it, thank you for pointing me. :D
But this information has been issued after 12 days of scanning, a bit too late, IMHO.
But what disturbs me is the absolute indifference of community members to this question, probably I'm one of the few (if any) that try to understand, not only to check movies.
It looks like for most of us the main goal is to achieve a certificate, or a good ranking, or enter the top 100 scores, isn't it?
Bye

Andrea :D
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Wolter
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Post by Wolter »

The update mentioned above as well as the news from 16th tells me that the team is working hard on the results found until now.
However they have limited access to the collector (only a view hours per week) since the automatic scan is running almost 24/7.
Furthermore at the moment they can only look at the locations marked in the movies. As far as i am aware they do not take any samples yet.
So at this point they can only say: yes please keep pointing us to these features you have found or not. Something they just did.

See also update http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... .php?t=879 from today :lol:

Concerning responses the following FAQ http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... .php?t=682 might interest you.

The reason for our involvement is to speed up the filtering of the available data so that the team starts their work on the most promissing part of the aerogel. The stats are purely to assist the team in finding which filter is the most efficient.

It has been said on several ocasions: this is groundbreaking sience, any finding has to be checked again and again before any judgement on its value can be given. It will take al lot of time. Be patient.

Until now the verdict is: keep on going the way your are.

I hope this will be enough for you for the time being...

Happy hunting
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andrea
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Post by andrea »

Wolter wrote:The update mentioned above as well as the news from 16th tells me that the team is working hard on the results found until now.
However they have limited access to the collector (only a view hours per week) since the automatic scan is running almost 24/7....
OK Wolter, but IMHO it was far better if all these explanations were given "before" the scanning start, and not two weeks later, and moreover only after a growing number of doubts, questions, and negative comments arose from the scanners. :cry:

It looks like someone preferred to leave the "people", the unskilled workers, in the ignorance, while "science" is for other minds. But due to the many positive comments on our work given by Stardust staff, I remain of the opinion that someone there made a mistake, and didn't take care of the highly positive psychological effect that knowledge and information gives to any human activity.

Moreover, and this is truly dramatic, all the information given now would have been very important before starting, during the training.
Just an example: only now we know that it's absolutely not sure that the dust particles will show in the real movies as in the test ones, probably will be very different. :evil:

Up to now I (and probably many other people) searched and pointed out only what was absolutely identical or very close to what had been shown in the test images, because I found no information on this.
Moreover, these information have been scattered among the 6363 articles of the forum, with only 2062 people inscribed, so that the remaining 9544 have no information at all.

Such information had to be well evident in the tutorial, not in the forum.
Do you truly think that this is the right way to operate?

I'm an industry manager, and during the many training courses for personnel management I followed, the most important suggestion I received from teachers has always been "spread, spread, always spread information among your staff".
Probably Stardust Team managers didn't follow the same courses. :wink:
Wolter wrote:.....Happy hunting
The same for all of us! :)
Bye

Andrea :D
Andrea Pelloni
MPC 157 Frasso Sabino Obs
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Co-discoverer of Sn2005bp-Sn2005dz-Sn2005kd-Sn2006bq

DustBuster
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Post by DustBuster »

andrea wrote:only now we know that it's absolutely not sure that the dust particles will show in the real movies as in the test ones, probably will be very different.
Such information had to be well evident in the tutorial, not in the forum.
This information is included in page 1 of the tutorial (the last paragraph)

http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... _start.php
No dessert for you- ONE MONTH!

andrea
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Post by andrea »

DustBuster wrote:
andrea wrote:only now we know that it's absolutely not sure that the dust particles will show in the real movies as in the test ones, probably will be very different.
Such information had to be well evident in the tutorial, not in the forum.
This information is included in page 1 of the tutorial (the last paragraph)
http://stardustathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/ ... _start.php
OK, it's there, but I told "WELL EVIDENT" like this, and that is not evident. :wink:
And where are all the other information? :shock:
Bye

Andrea :D
Andrea Pelloni
MPC 157 Frasso Sabino Obs
WorldPoss Sn Team Member
Co-discoverer of Sn2005bp-Sn2005dz-Sn2005kd-Sn2006bq

DustBuster
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Post by DustBuster »

andrea wrote:OK, it's there, but I told "WELL EVIDENT" like this, and that is not evident. :wink:
And where are all the other information? :shock:
Bye

Andrea :D
Hi again.
I don't feel I'm qualified to determine what you consider well evident, but the fact that the total text of the tutorial is about one full page and the topic appears on the first page leads me to believe it was meant to be stressed early in the tutorial.

As for the other information, please be specific as I am not sure to what you are referring. If it's the announcement that Wolter pointed out, that information was not available until yesterday.

Hope that helps.
No dessert for you- ONE MONTH!

kari
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Post by kari »

ROFL ... What's evident if not the tutorial you're supposed to read and understand before starting to dust? :?:
Expect the Unexpected

This is research: the outcome of this project is highly uncertain
edit: By the way.. this forum is public.. anyone can read it. Important sections like the FAQ are directly linked under the "community" section. I've seen much worse project communication ;)

andrea
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Post by andrea »

kari wrote:ROFL ... What's evident if not the tutorial you're supposed to read and understand before starting to dust? :?:
OK, all of you reply to single aspects, but not to the general one, IMO, that is:
when one starts a project like this, first of all he/she/they have to train the involved people well BEFORE STARTING (this is well evident, IMO), so that everyone may have the time to dedicate to his own training, well before starting.

But this happened about 24 hours before the beginning, correct?
And moreover with a lot of connection problems, so that everyone, you too, was in a hurry to follow the tutorial in order to obtain the certificate to partecipate to scanning as soon as possible. :?

All the information on how the SD Team would have proceeded was well known surely a lot before starting on Aug 1st, but they informed us only a couple days ago or so and, I repeat, only after a lot of negative comments in the forum.

For my taste this is not correct, and even more because this is an activity that allows NASA to save a lot of money, having about 11000 people that use their free time to achieve this, free of charge for USA taxpayers.
Well, in return I ask for previous, clear, unequivocal information, and I don't think this is an unfair request, I think it's absolutely due. :!:

Anyhow, it looks like I'm the only one to have this opinion, so don't worry, keep your one and I'll take mine.
Obviously I'll go on with scanning, but surely with far less enthusiasm than before.
Bye and good dusting!

Andrea :D
Andrea Pelloni
MPC 157 Frasso Sabino Obs
WorldPoss Sn Team Member
Co-discoverer of Sn2005bp-Sn2005dz-Sn2005kd-Sn2006bq

kari
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Post by kari »

Yes, we obviously don't share the same opinion. I observed the connection problems and as I'm extremely interested in the science of this project I read and understood the tutorial without rush.

IMHO the only way to make all these aspects more evident would be popups every x pageloads :P (prove me wrong and provide constructive advice)

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