Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

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DanZ
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by DanZ » Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:59 pm

Thanks for staying with us Evelyn! BTW, I ran this little hiccup regarding the new Skill Score formula by Dr. Westphal and he ended up doing a full analysis to convince himself of it. His report follows. Dan

I went back to rerun the Monte Carlo simulation to confirm that the skill score can go down even if one clicks correctly on a low-value movie. Here's what I did. For each trial, I drew randomly 101 power movies. For each movie, I assumed that the response was 100% correct if the powerscore was less than 70, and 100% wrong if the powerscore was more than 70. I then computed the score from power movies 1 through 100, and also for power movies 2 through 101. I did this for 10,000 trials. I found that in the 1366 cases is which the skillscore went down, 396 of those cases were for correct responses.

I redid it for a threshold of 40 instead of 70 and the numbers are 3643 and 867, respectively.

I then just assumed that 50% of the movies were randomly clicked correctly, regardless of powerscore. Then the numbers are 4376 and 920, respectively.

To confirm that this has to do with the fact that we are now calculating from the previous 100 movies, rather than back to the beginning, I redid the calculation comparing the score from movies 1 through 100, to that from movies 1 through 101. In this case, there are no cases of the score going down. So as expected, this fluctuation has to do with the fact that we are computing on a moving window 100 movies wide. As John Smaje pointed out originally, the skill score cannot go down, regardless of the movie value, if you just add onto the whole sequence of responses. But if you have a window, responses are dropping out as you add more movies.

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Sun Aug 11, 2013 3:28 pm

DanZ, What happened? When I signed off this am, my Skill Score was .9352, and Power Score = 7160

I just now signed back in, and my Skill Score had dropped to .9052! Power score still at 7160. I am not recorded as having missed any tracks between times, I couldn't have since I haven't been dusting---what in the world happened? Very discouraged, and heart sick!

Thanks,
Evelyn (ERSTRS, SmithES)

DanZ
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by DanZ » Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:00 pm

Hmmmmmm....did anyone else experience a sudden drop?

Evelyn - the change happened before you did any dusting, correct? If there was any dusting on your part between the time you checked your score previously and when you signed back on, I could explain this. Otherwise, I could imagine the "60 day" time check kicking in and you no longer meeting the required 100 movies in the "new" 60 day period, but then your score should not display at all.

If anyone else experienced an unexplained drop in Skill Score and can report on it here, that would help. In the meantime, I have a meeting with the team tomorrow and will run this by them.

Thanks for your patience!

Dan

caprarom
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by caprarom » Fri Aug 23, 2013 4:52 am

No such experience here. I did have my score drop slightly once after successfully flagging an 80-point PM. An 85-pointer must have dropped out the 100-PM window. It felt weird, but I didn't think much about it.

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:05 am

Thanks, "cap," I wish I had your eye for finding tracks! 1.000 skill score---unbelievable! CONGRATULATIONS!
For the past few days, I've had the following experiences:
PS=7860---SS=9140; PS=7865---and SS dropped to 9131; PS=7910---SS jumped to 9223 after finding a 20 pt. track . A 5 pt. knocked me down
nine SS points. Closed out: 7930 & .9223. This morning, I checked in at PS=7930, and SS= 9223; found a 5 pt. track. SS dropped to .9219. Then, after
viewing 28 slides without a track, I found a 20 pt. That raised my PS to 7955, but my SS dropped to .9211. In other words, I found tracks with
total value of 25 points, yet my skill score dropped from .9223 to .9211. I can see where I'm headed if I keep dusting today---straight downward
regardless of how many tracks I find. I've had this experience over and over. I'll try again tomorrow and see if my SS will go up when I find a track.
If it does, I'll keep at it for awhile.
Also, in addition to the 100 day thing, and the past skill ratings for a particular day, dusting is also dependent on the "luck of the draw." I'm good at
finding tracks worth less than 50 points. But I don't seem to get enough of them in a row so I can build up my SS, before I miss one valued at more
than 50 points! As you know, once I did make it to #14 on the SS list. But then I missed several "biggie" in a row---and fell to #22! Now, I'm back up
to #17 on the list.
Oh, Well, I am so pleased to be a part of the dusting program, that I count myself blessed beyond measure that I can find a track at all. Signed on
in August 2006, and have enjoyed both dusting and getting to meet some new friends, too. So, I will stick with it until you guys call it quits. I'll also
try to quit complaining so much!
Evelyn (ERSTRS, SmithES)

DanZ
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by DanZ » Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:29 am

You're not complaining Evelyn, don't worry. :)

You have some great notes here! Is it possible you could give us approximate times when these things happen (including time zone)? Especially for the incident that started this discussion, when your Skill Score went from .9352 to .9052 (per your previous post). That way we might be able to dig into the computer logs a bit better and see if we can figure out how this happened.

Dan

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Sat Aug 24, 2013 9:17 am

DanZ, Here are screen shots from my dusting this morning. The time is recorded (EDT). I'll keep sending those if they will be of help.
I had one drop in SS. #4-- I found a 10 pt. and SS dropped from .9218 to .9214.
1-began Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.11.13 AM.png
1-began Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.11.13 AM.png (32.45 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
2-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.22.59 AM.png
2-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.22.59 AM.png (31.4 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
3-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.44.34 AM.png
3-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.44.34 AM.png (31.84 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
3-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.44.34 AM.png
3-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.44.34 AM.png (31.84 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
Limit of three attachments. Will send other two in another post.
Evelyn (ERSTRS)

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Sat Aug 24, 2013 9:22 am

#4 screen shot is the one that dropped from SS.9218 to .9214 after I clicked on a 10 pt. track. Evelyn (ERSTRS)
4- dropped Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.52.23 AM.png
4- dropped Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.52.23 AM.png (31.72 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
5- Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.59.26 AM.png
5- Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.59.26 AM.png (31.38 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
#5 screen shot-
5- Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.59.26 AM.png
5- Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 11.59.26 AM.png (31.38 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
#6 screen shot - log off:
6- log-out-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 12.00.18 PM.png
6- log-out-Screen shot 2013-08-24 at 12.00.18 PM.png (31.06 KiB) Viewed 15135 times
Thanks to all you guys for answering my calls for Help!

Evelyn (ERSTRS)

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:29 am

Another report. On 8-25-13, My SS was .9333, and PS=8140. I found a 15 pt. track and this is what happened--SS dropped to .9325 and PS rose to 8155..
1. Screen shot 2013-08-25 at 9.39.11 PM.png
1. Screen shot 2013-08-25 at 9.39.11 PM.png (31.38 KiB) Viewed 15125 times
2- dropped Screen shot 2013-08-25 at 10.00.20 PM.png
2- dropped Screen shot 2013-08-25 at 10.00.20 PM.png (32.62 KiB) Viewed 15125 times
.

Then, on 8-26-13, SS .9335, and PS=8220, I found a 25 pt., and SS fell to .9323, even though PS rose to 8245.
3. dropped Screen shot 2013-08-26 at 11.53.02 AM.png
3. dropped Screen shot 2013-08-26 at 11.53.02 AM.png (32.38 KiB) Viewed 15125 times
THEN, I can send it if you need it---I found a 50 pt. track and my PS rose from 8245 to 8295, and my SS rose from .9323 to .9332. What I think is unusual about that is: On 8-25-13, when my PS=8195, my SS was .9332. Yet after my PS rose 100 points (!) to 8295, my SS was the same---.9332!

Does this help with figuring out what is going on? Or is my experience normal?

Thanks, Guys, Evelyn (ERSTRS)

caprarom
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by caprarom » Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:10 am

For the most part, Evelyn, these look like normal fluctuations to me. The power score simply increments as expected based upon the value of the PM you find. The skill score, however, can go up or down depending upon the value of the PM you found (or missed) 100 PMs previously. For example, you correctly flag a 35-point PM. If 100 PMs previously, you had correctly flagged a 70-point PM, your skill score will go down. If instead you had correctly flagged a 15-point PM 100 PMs previously, your skill score will go up. If you had missed a PM 100 previously, especially a low-value PM, your skill score might go up significantly. (Your skill score could even go up if you miss a PM. That would happen if you missed a lower-value PM 100 previously.) I hope that helps rather than confuses the issue.

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:48 am

Thanks caprarom, That does explain it satisfactorily--- I am a competitive gal, and would like to climb to the top! But, I'll stop worrying about it and just continue enjoying dusting, regardless of where I stand on SS. Evelyn (ERSTRS)

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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by DanZ » Mon Oct 07, 2013 1:48 pm

So sorry to be away for so long everyone! I'm truly :oops: !

First, thanks a million caprarom for explaining the reasoning behind the fluctuations so well. As far as we know, you are correct. But then what we can't understand is why so many dusters have perfect Skill Scores and hold them so well. One of the techs is looking at a better way to track people's progress, which will help explain these things we think, and will also more visually explain what Evelyn has been going through. Let me find out the status on this new tool and get back to you.

caprarom - any thoughts yourself on why so many dusters have perfect Skill Scores? At this moment, I and others are baffled. But since you've been there, maybe it makes perfect sense to you.

Again, my sincerest apologies for being so dreadfully absent. Hopefully I'll be a little more reliable in the future.

Dan

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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by DanZ » Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:14 pm

caprarom wrote:No such experience here. I did have my score drop slightly once after successfully flagging an 80-point PM. An 85-pointer must have dropped out the 100-PM window. It felt weird, but I didn't think much about it.
Hi caprarom,

The team is very surprised that you were able to score one of the 80 pointers! If it's not too late, can you tell us which PM it was and how you decided where to click?

Any and all info appreciated!

Dan

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:24 am

Welcome back, Dan! I've had an interesting time since posting last. Discouraged, and doing little dusting. Once I find a track, and my Skill Score goes down, I sign out. I know where it is going for the rest of the day, so I'll wait until the next day to see if things improve. My SS was at .9838 recently, with PS at 10460. I clicked on a 65 pt track but my SS rose only to .9839. That's all I got for a 65 pt. track! (PS rose from 10460 to 10525, but the SS rose only .0001.)
Next, I missed a 55 pt. track and my SS dropped to .9721---down from .9839. Why would I get only .0001 credit on SS for a 65 point track ----and be penalized so severely for missing a 55 point ? (dropping SS from .9839 to .9721?) I don't understand either SS value--the low reward for a 65 pt. track, nor the severe drop after missing a 55 pt track.

The pattern continues this morning------10 days after finding the 65 pt. track. I'm still bouncing around in the .9700 range. When my SS was .9728, and PS 11160, I found a 55 pt. track. SS rose to .9732--and PS rose to 11215. Then, later when PS rose to 11290, my SS had dropped to .9729. (I had not missed a track---I had found tracks that raised my PS 75 points!) My reward for finding 75 points? A drop in SS!

I'm a competitive gal--- I want the rewards for my labors! Not getting them. Evelyn

SmithES
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Re: Answers to Qs about: VM, Movies, Scores… UPDATED 6:56pm

Post by SmithES » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:31 am

Dan, I decided to give it another try this afternoon. Attached two examples.

#1, SS was .9729. PS= 11290.
Clicked on a 15 pt. track, SS dropped to .9726. PS=11305.

#2 clicked on a 5 pt track. SS dropped to .9725. PS= 11310.

I figure, at this rate, I'll have no Skill Score left if I keep clicking on tracks!

Evelyn
#1 .png
#1 .png (22.93 KiB) Viewed 15068 times
#2.png
#2.png (21.61 KiB) Viewed 15068 times

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